If the video of the tragic shootings in New Zealand was posted to Steemit / DTube, should it be taken down?
If the video of the tragic shootings in New Zealand was posted to Steemit / DTube, should it be taken down?
Without wishing to make light of the tragic murders in New Zealand yesterday, it throws up a real test for the anti-censorship stance of this blockchain.
All over the internet, this Facebook live video is being propagated and shared whilst at the same time, being removed as fast as possible by all the social media sites when they find another uploaded copy.
If perchance, it were to appear here on Steemit or DTube, does the community think it should be removed, or left up?
Would this be a real test case for Steem or would it be a specific occasion when that indelible principle needs to be broken?
Please answer and give considered opinion. Thank-you
- Yes, it should be removed
- No, it shouldn't be removed
Answer the question at dpoll.xyz.
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If you mean a recording of an actual/real shooting, and people dying (or even getting injured) in the video, then yes, certainly/definitely. It should be removed.
Especially, if the families, relatives and/or friends of the victims are requesting it, and they probably/most likely (will) do (or already doing it).
This primarily should not be a matter of censorship.
This primarily should be a matter of respect and humanity.
Imagine yourself in the place of them. Either in the place of the victims, or in the place of their families, relatives and/or friends.
You would probably do/wish/request the same.
Except for the face(s) of the shooter(s)/criminal(s), of course.
That should be shown everywhere to make people able to recognize the murderer(s)/criminal(s).
I don't know the situation and the details, but I think that this would be the most logical/obvious (or at least good/proper) move.
Thanks for your considered and in-depth answer! Excellent points raised.
Agreed, apart from... "Except for the face(s) of the shooter(s)/criminal(s), of course. That should be shown everywhere to make people able to recognize the murderer(s)/criminal(s)."
Can't agree with that.
We are all innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Anyone who has served their prison time and been released has the right to move on with their lives.
In this particular case, there's not a lot of doubt, as the guy was caught in the act. He may have been hoping for martydom/death-by-police/being-put-down-like-a-rabid-dog (depending on your perspective). And given the nature of the crime, I doubt he'll get out of prison alive.
But it's the principle of the thing, and goes back to the old argument: "What if it was you arrested? For something you didn't do? How would you want society to react?"
"We are all innocent until proven guilty in a court of law."
Can't agree with that.
Let's say that you are witnessing/witnessed a mass murder (you may even get injured during the shooting), and you clearly see the faces of the murderers/killers.
You may even know them. This can also go with the victims.
Let's say that you know them. They are your family and your friends.
Would you say (even for a second) that the shooting persons are innocent? I highly doubt it.
And you also mentioned yourself that "In this particular case, there's not a lot of doubt, as the guy was caught in the act."
"Anyone who has served their prison time and been released has the right to move on with their lives."
I did not said that the released criminals don't have the right to move on with their lives (who am I to say such a thing?), but a mass murdererer is still a mass murderer, no matter what.
They would get a lifelong prison or even a death sentence in some countries.
I know that the lifelong prison is not literally lifelong in most of the cases, so even if they will get a lifelong prison, then there is still a legal possibility that they will get out of prison alive.
Except, if they will get a lifelong sentence without parole or conditional release.
"And given the nature of the crime, I doubt he'll get out of prison alive."
But maybe he will, maybe not. We don't know know yet.
He can be killed in the prison by other prisoners (or even by the prison guards).
But if he get out of prison alive, then there is a (probably high) possibility that he will kill/murder people again, but like I said, I don't know the situation and the details.
"But it's the principle of the thing, and goes back to the old argument: "What if it was you arrested? For something you didn't do? How would you want society to react?""
It is certain that there are innocent people, who got arrested and sentenced to serve a certain time in prison, but I think that this question is irrelevant in this case, because there is an undoubted proof (video recording, plus there are probably many witnesses) in this case.
And you even wrote this yourself.
Not voting as I can't really make a choice... I guess there is nothing stopping it going up. But I would be interested to see if the community as whole joins in flagging it... I would like to think that I would flag it. It isn't censorship if it is flagged, just one step more to view.
LOL get off that fence, its my fence so find a fence of your own!! But this exactly why I posted the question. I'm in two minds too, and I think many other people will be, but I just thought it would be an interesting, albeit uncomfortable question to answer.
Thanks for commenting mate :-)
I think you are going to need a wider fence! I suspect that most people would join us here...
I've similar problem @bengy, @nathen007
It's hard to make right choice here. Whatever we choose consequences can be real awful. All can be done is "damage control".
Anyway .... content on Steemit can be censored but whatever is on blockchain will stay there. And someone can create some simple front-end which would display all content (regardless if it's banned on Steemit or not) and will be able to access it regardless of our efforts.
Does it make sense?
Cheers
Piotr
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I thought it can't be removed from blockchain... so the question is purely theoretical.
See your point, but it could be removed from sight, so you'd have to go looking for it in the blockchain files, and not find it in the apps used by most people most of the time.
Facebook et al won't have deleted the video - it's evidence and it's a valuable commodity. At some point in the (hopefully distant) future it will re-surface. All they've done is stopped access to the video.
IPFS, Sia or PPIO blockchain file storage systems? Can't they store forever?
DTube videos disappear all the time. I thought the video and photographic content here was held on central servers? I might be wrong, it's not unusual !!
Aren't they on IPFS? IPFS claims files never disappear.
I have found D.tube videos not working, but I thought only the downloading was too slow.
I will look into this my friend. I thought one of the problems with Dtube was that people complained their videos were being removed after a few months.
I will try and find some old posts and find out.
I pretty much agree with @xplosive, in that you should imagine if you were a victim or the family of the victim. How would you feel if people saw the footage?
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Yes, for basic human decency.
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morally, yes by the person who put it up. and it also should be flagged to shit by everyone else
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