Will Facebook kill Steem overnight?
Competition from Facebook is coming
As much as I appreciate Steem, the community, the ecosystem, I think it is time we accept that Steem no longer has the competitive technological advantage. Steem started in 2016 and I was one of the first bloggers on Steem during that time. At the time Steem was state of the art and had the best technology in the space. Now it is 2019 and many other technologies can scale or are stronger than Steem. On top of that there is now competition from Kik, from Facebook, which could literally reduce demand for Steem.
Facebook has over a billion users. If Facebook integrates Facebook coin and it's a true stablecoin then it's essentially a competitor to the Steem dollar. This might explain why Steem price has been so ridiculously low and falling. The news of Facebook releasing Project Libra? It is possible Facebook could literally remove the use case for Steem.
It is true Facebook does censor, but doesn't Steem also have community standards? It is true that Steem had a head start in technology but doesn't Facebook have the money to hire as many programmers as they need and potentially even try to hire Dan Larimer himself (not saying he would accept it).
On the one hand if Facebook does produce a competitor to Steem it means crypto is finally mainstream. The problem is does it also mean all of our Steem tokens will become worthless overnight? Does the Steem community even have a plan to hold itself together against the threat of Facebook? I think @ned and others should address this question and the SteemBlog should announce something in response to the Facebook news.
No but steems price is lagging big time and smt is still months away. I have a feeling it is going to be to late. They should have completed most of it last year. Idk wtf all those developers did last year it seems like nothing which pisses me off as well as others.
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Hello, have you been in a coma or something or why does it seem you have missed the token creation functionality on Steem-Engine?
Lol
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I'm not sure what FB coin will be used for exactly I assume purchasing ads space, goods from retailers, promoting content and paying publishers. I highly doubt they would be rewarding every person on the platform with the coin and for the most part users won't even know about it, may just be a faster payment method to what they currently have for the services they currently have
To rapidly change their business model to what steem is doing, I really don't see that happening. Yes they can hire the best engineers and create an awesome project and who knows it could help money flow out of facebook into the greater crypto space, we dont know.
I just don't see the average facebook user benefitting from the change, Facebook has always been an advertiser first platform not a user first.
No shit Sherlock. Facebook has two billion users. Paying them ten cents a day on average would cause Facebook to bleed 200 million dollars a day. That would translate into 7.3 billion in lost revenue per year. Per user, 10 cents a day would be pretty much meaningless. Make it a dollar, and you'd be looking at 73 billion a year and a total annihilation of Facebook as a profitable business.
No, because users can get paid for clicking ads, and this could be used to funnel money into content by monetizing likes or backing the likes with real money. In other words yes the advertiser money in Facebook is plenty to monetize user content and also to filter the low quality content out.
I don't think we should assume Facebook won't do it merely because they haven't done it in the past. If we look at Amazon we can see Amazon used to be a book store online and look at them now.
That money cannot be significant to any degree. The value of a single person clicking an ad is extremely low.
We don't know how much the value will be in the future. You are assuming the value is static? We could say the same about Steem too.
The value is a simple fact of how much it returns. One ad click will always be insignificant squared.
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You don't know the value of human attention? It's the most valuable thing humans have to offer.
The ads can make as much money as they produce sales. But it's not just selling products. People want attention for many many reasons as we can see Instagram is completely powered by that.
No it's not. The ads can't make as much money as they produce in sales. Simple math. Ultimately, I could name hundreds of things that humans can offer that are endlessly more valuable than attention.
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The revenue from ads isn't going to end up in users pockets, it would ruin the revenue stream. You talk about backing likes with real money as that would return any revenue or it wouldn't Bleed them dry.
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Just because you don't want something to happen it doesn't mean it can't happen. You speak with such certainty as if you either don't want Facebook to do it (which I understand) or you have inside info.
Facebook will get money from the ratio in the same way Youtube does. In fact they'd get even more money because more people would use the platform, click the ads, create content etc. It's kind of like if you say "if you give people more of their own money by lowering taxes, it will bankrupt the government".
No, I speak from a logical standpoint. The revenue stream is diverged and eventually it will not be sustainable and bankrupt the company. And yes, if you lowered taxes (if it wasn't already bankrupt) it would bankrupt the government. No revenue. How can you not understand simple math:
Revenue comes from selling ads, giving revenue away for no returns simply to get everyone to join is nonsense and let's sat that eventually everyone joins Facebook, what then? What is the purpose of giving money away for likes and shares or status updates? Incentives for more likes and status updates with the hope of clicking on ads? How silly are you, do you realize that the miniscule amount that one click generates isn't even a cent of a cent of a cent of a cent, and that's IF they clicked on an ad.
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Take Instagram for example? The model for Instagram isn't simply to sell ads. Instagram is about influence and influencers. It's about the attention economy. There is a scarce amount of human attention in the market. In order for there to be accounts with millions of followers there has to be a way for those accounts to get attention.
Right there you have all the market dynamics necessary to make plenty of money without having to use traditional ad models. What you're talking about is traditional revenue generating business models. Instagram isn't the traditional model and neither is Facebook or Amazon.
I admit you can make a case that currently the Facebook like economy which is a market of it's own, is currently not using a currency which people are valuing in USD. While Steem has the same upvote economy which is using a currency people value in USD.
If Facebook has a stable token and it's more stable than the Steem Dollar this changes things. Suddenly Facebook at any time could decide to integrate this token into Instagram, Facebook, or WhatsApp. This token alone would potentially kill Steem depending on how Facebook chooses to integrate it.
Facebook could choose to for example pay the user to watch ads or interact with certain accounts. The money would come from accounts which want more attention from users. Facebook could take a small cut of the profit, say 20%, and the 80% goes to the users. So there is no reason to believe Facebook would somehow lose money.
We see the model already on Coinbase with Coinbase Earn. When you watch a video and answer some quiz questions you earn tokens. This model scales, and Instagram could integrate it.
Who said it's about getting clicks? You did. I didn't.
To watch a video is worth more than a click. A click obviously has some value measured in some microtransaction, but to watch a video also has value. To watch a video and learn (pass a quiz) has much more value than to just watch a video, and to do some action such as to re-post something has as much value as your account is worth.
Just because you're not creative enough to figure out how many markets can be formed using a token on Facebook infrastructure it does not mean Facebook employees aren't creative enough to know what they have.
Steem made the mistake of not knowing what we have. And now we are in a position where the value of our tokens decreases continuously.
You think that the revenue stream is irrelevant, nothing more needs to be said. So yeah, who said anything about the revenue of Facebook, lol.
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It has absolutely nothing to do with what I want, but nice projection, Mrs."will steem get killed/nofud".
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I don't make posts based on what I want to happen. I'm looking at data. Look at the current trajectory of the Steem price to BTC ratio. BTC is going up, other alt tokens are going up, but Steem consistently is going down.
So until the data says something different my post is justified by the data and not by emotions.
What data? Lol?
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Fear=O no look at the price of steem
Uncertainty =O no will steem's price go up anytime soonest
Doubt=O no will we Survive Facebook
Ridiculous
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Yeah but Facebook is...the evil empire.
Facebook will absolutely not be rewarding all of its users like Steem does. That wouldn't make any business sense whatsoever. Facebook will definitely not throw its shareholders under the bus for the benefit of its TWO BILLION users to give them any of significant minority of them any kind of meaningful rewards.
This type of clickbaity FUD is getting tiresome. It's almost entirely comes from 2016'ers who are no longer getting the kind of totally unsustainable minor lottery winnings type of rewards as in the summer of 2016 before the epic but 100% predictable crash in STEEM price that year.
The difference between Steem and Facebook will always remain the fact that Steem is user-owned. If Facebook introduces payment functionality through a stablecoin, that will be a completely different animal compared to what holding Steem Power means.
How do you know? Youtube rewarded it's posters with ad revenue. What makes you think Facebook can't? I don't see why they wouldn't if it would give them a competitive advantage over platforms like Steem which are threatening to replace Facebook.
Then how come hasn't YouTube "killed" DTube already?
How many people are using DTube compared to Youtube?
Not many, but do you think that's because YouTube is so awesome at rewarding its regular users monetarily compared to DTube?
So you think that they will go all in so that they can try to take out steem, despite the fact that steem has gained it's users not just because of rewards but because Facebook censored them and steem in turn is censorship proof..
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Yes and YouTube also takes a huge cut of that as revenue their users create. Plus they manipulate the algorithms, manipulate the data that determines revenue payouts, and can and will not pay you your cut for a long list of reasons, with little to zero arbitration. Facebook or any other mainstream social media platform will have the chance to do the right thing and pay content creators and users, but history shows that is unlikely. I think they are likely to advertise such features, but will exercise control over the algorithms, data, and the control of if you are paid.
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In my opinion Facebook can give touch competition but cannot kill steem.
!dramatoken
I don't see facebook as a competitor to STEEM. They are totally different entities. We do see a lot of other competitors emerging in the space but we still have the advantage over them with a tested system, new developments and a strong core community.
If STEEM was staying as a simple social media site then I would be a lot more worried about it disappearing but with the direction we are heading it will be so much more. It will be an eco-system for social and gaming sites to build on complete with tradeable tokens. Just look at the new 3speak platform that is being brought out. I don't think we will ever have a billion users but it could be very successful in the tens of millions. There are plenty ways to operate around facebook as they are losing popularity by the day.
I'm looking at the fact that Steem doesn't know how to generate profit. It's been losing for a while now. So how can we have so much infinite confidence?
2018 was a horrible year for Steem. We all knew SMTs were critical and the launch of SMTs went about as bad as it could possibly go. So if you have so much confidence in Steem feel free to buy the token.
Another person who pointed out that this is about freedom, decentralized Vs centralized, completely different games. Guess what. Steem is not an entity, it's exactly like saying that Ubuntu did not generate any profit, even though 90% of the software is written on it. Same here, there is no place on the web that has as much content creation as steem or has distributed as much wealth as steem, but Steem does not know how to generate profit, because it all comes down to the current market and valuation in shitoshi.
Comparing an incorporated censorship ridden platform with a open source decentralized, community owned and driven, completely committed to freedom of expression platform. Classic, non FUD material.
I totally disagree with you here. Look at everything that has been built in 2018. Mira is getting released in a few weeks to make it cheaper to run the chain. Aggroed has released SMT's with his own group. We can now onboard as many users as we like. We have games, hivemind, tokens. There has been so many improvments made to the blockchain that it's unrecognisable from the start of 2018. The only thing that has been terrible is the price of STEEM which like every other token had a terrible year.
Since I am not selling that doesn't bother me at all for now. In fact I was buying and bought all the way down to 20c like a lot of other people who believe in the project. The only real failing that i cn agree wit you is the failings of steemit.inc to generate revenue and deliver on their promises. They have improved but still a long way to go.
And still the price of the token keeps going down. The data doesn't lie. The token price is failing and so is platform growth. Until I see the numbers change my views don't change.
No, the other tokens are doing much much better. Look at Coinmarketcap position.
Point to me said community standards. AFAIK there is no such thing. Not only that, but you're seriously comparing a decentralized solution with a centralized one and said decentralized solution was literally created purpose explicit to be censorship proof. You're also saying that Steem's use case is simply social media platform with stable coin, yet that is not what it is, Steem is much more than social media even if social media is an overwhelming aspect of it it has other uses/objectives than to be a censorship proof platform, in the white paper it talks about empowering people and distributing the coin. The threat can only manifest in the form of another competitor that embraces both Decentralization and Immutability, as the community is in no way going to jump ship for anything less, the vast majority are either here because of censorship on Facebook or because of the desire for something more trustworthy than Fiat, and I don't see Facebook paying their users one cent.
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Steemit I'm not convinced was created to be truly censorship proof. Steem is censorship proof already. You can't delete from the Steem block chain but no website will make it easy to find.
We aren't talking about steemit.com but Steem. The white paper says
It also talks about the only real concern for censorship on steem via top witnesses censoring transactions and how that would be a quick way for them to lose the top 19 status. Anyway, where is this elusive community standard?
I still don't understand how a centralized, censorship ridden "platform" can compete with steem or who in their right mind would go from THE bastion of free speech to the belly of the beast.
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Agree
By paying it's users that is how.
Let me ask you again since you seemingly are oblivious to what the question was concerning:
How can a centralized censorship ridden "platform" compete with a censorship proof decentralized platform? You think that you can simply pay people better than steem so they can be censored? Seemingly you believe that censorship proof is not something important for steem or it's users, which is just as ridiculous as the thought that Facebook will pay it's users. Facebook is not in the business of employing their users at all, you do know that?
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Centralized or decentralized has nothing to do with profitable or unprofitable. Steem is unprofitable. Facebook is profitable.
I didn't think Facebook would ever be profitable but I was wrong. They know how to run a business and make a profit. It's this element which Facebook is good at which Steem is horrible at. Along with UX which Facebook is brilliant at and Steem is horrible at.
Facebook seeks to grow as much as possible. If it means letting users get paid then they'll do it. The competitors like Google has no problem letting users get paid. Twitter also is talking about integrating cryptocurrency. At this time I don't know what Jack plans to do with crypto but it shows me that Twitter has some plans.
Steem is still more profitable than any other platform combined.
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Almost every single person pointed out that this is about decentralized Vs centralized, yet it's irrelevant. Nothing more needs to be said, especially when you think that freedom of expression isn't crucial here, since who wouldn't want to get paid for towing the elitist leftist party line.
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If you think Facebook coin or any other so called stable coin will outlast a decentralized coin, you will learn. Yes, fb and other social media apps may adopt crypto, but it will be centralized, probably un-capped, and once it’s big business, they will fuck it all up, just like every other centralized financial institution. Sure, short term, it’s a threat. Long term, that shit will crash and burn like the rest of the centralized garbage we already have. Steem has its share of problems and growing pains, but at least it’s not centralized garbage that will be abused.
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We don't know enough about the platform to know it's centralized or decentralized or to what degree. We just don't know yet.Do you know something most of us don't?
Do you mean whether FB Coin will be centralized or decentralized? No, there’s no information that I’ve read on that. But do you honestly think FB or any other platform will run on a decentralized ledger? I highly doubt it. They are all about controlling your data, and now they will want to control your money. If they were decentralized I’d be shocked. I don’t even know if they would be able to legally entertain that idea. FB decentralized currency used for terrorism, drugs, and child porn? That would be a public relations nightmare for them. Facebook is set up as an entity that can be sued. No lawyer would advise them to create a currency in which they cannot control the transactions and identity of the user. I’m not sure why we would think there’s even a chance it won’t be a centralized ledger.
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I honestly don't know what they'll do or what aspects they' decentralize or centralize. I think for certain aspects it makes sense for security to put it on the decentralized ledger but for other purposes it makes more sense to put it on the centralized ledger (for legal compliance reasons).
So it totally depends. FB currency even if decentralized would also be capable of being whitelisted and blacklisted by the Facebook community standards. This means you can have a decentralized token which is also censored or heavily influenced. Any token which has interacted with anything illegal could simply not be accepted by Facebook, and can be tainted, blacklisted by Facebook, etc. They have ways if they choose to go decentralized.
The Steem blockchain can be used for more than social media, so it's a matter of adding more use cases. We will have to see how Facebook implements it's coin. It all comes down to the token economics.
I think it was just a matter of time for some mainstream corporations to start to compete with the cryptospace (JP Morgan coin comes to mind). If anything all the blockchains need to up their game not just Steem.
Yes but anything the Steem blockchain can do the Facebook blockchain would be able to do.
I'll never use facebook, even if zucker-bot coin becomes the world reserve currency.