Is our society really evolving?

in #philosophy6 years ago

In modern society, especially in the West, we tend to see the past as something totally inferior to the present, this is because we have a linear and sequential view of the time in which man and societies are ascending continuously, step by step , until we reach a utopian future that is in our imagination. Today is better than yesterday, whatever happens, we are one step ahead, and tomorrow will inevitably be better than today. The past is inferior and the future is superior, or at least we believe so.

Words like "primitive" or "outdated", undoubtedly have a negative connotation that attributes inferiority, on the contrary, words like "futuristic" and even "actual" are usually associated with positive connotations and superiority.

We believe that all the problems that exist today, someday in a future perhaps not so distant, cease to exist, because the continuous advance of society will take us to that desired paradise.

This marathon vision, in which each day we are closer to the goal, has not always been popular. In Ancient Greece, for example, according to some authors such as Hesiod and even Plato, man instead of progressing was degenerating, the myth of the "ages of man" postulates that the human had gone through different periods, from the Golden Age, in which man lived like the gods, without problems of any kind, always young, strong, wise, and without knowing the evil, going through the ages of Silver, Bronze, Heroic, in which it would progressively be corrupted (except in the Heroic Age), until finally reach the Iron Age, where there was no honor, and ignorance abounded, the gods had been forgotten, and evil, perversion, materialism, and injustice ruled, virtuous men would be extinguished, and the wicked would try to harm them through deception of all kinds.

In Rome, through Ovid, a similar myth would be introduced, although with only four ages (suppressing the Heroic Age).

The Vedics (and subsequently the Hindus) also had a similar vision, in which the world was divided into four ages (Yugas) that were degenerating little by little; from Satya Yuga (Age of Truth), to Kali Yuga (Age of discord).

Many of these myths were based on a nonlinear vision of history, but cyclical, and to some degree, circular. Man degenerates from his creation until reaching a point of total chaos, and depending on culture, the world is destroyed and reborn (as in Norse mythology) or progressively returns to reach its fullness (as in Vedicism), process that is repeated ad infinitum.

The curious thing about these mythologies and ancient beliefs is that they usually measured the man for his ideas, values, morals, customs, and even for happiness, whereas today on the contrary, we would be measuring man and societies for his material wealth, levels of production, industrial development, GDP, etc.

Listen to the futuristic enthusiasts and you will see how everyone talks about a technological utopia where there are no problems, not because man is more moral or more ideal, but because technology will avoid them.

You just have to look at the logic by which they seek to solve the problems in modernity; If rapes or juvenile perversion increase, abortion is the solution, but not cultural change. If the crimes or problems related to guns increase, a ban guns is the solution, but never social change.

We are reaching the point where we have a vision of social problems, and of all kinds, as only material problems, while ideas, morals, and everything that is invisible in a man, but which is latent and composes it, is cast aside and ignored.

Personally I don't see history in the same way as the ancient Greeks, Romans, Vedics and others, I believe that there must be a balance between material wealth and ideal wealth. Maybe I am very degenerate to see what they saw, it's possible, as it's possible that time has given us another perception, it is possible too.

But it is inevitable for me to mention that when the United States declared its independence in 1776, it led the world to an advance that had not been seen for more than a thousand years, and he reintroduced the word freedom, in a real way, in the vocabulary. This simple act would break with a process of quasi-deterministic degeneration, but on the contrary it would not mean the beginning of a similar process of progress.

I believe that history is a very complex process, and society as well as human depends on so many different factors, that it is impossible to accurately measure the advances and setbacks, so in turn, make a prediction of eternal progress, or an eternal degeneration, it's pretty far-fetched.

Human society is not a straight line of continuous advancement where every day we are better, and it is not a declining line that shows human decadence with respect to their ancestors, but rather it is a graph of lines that may seem random, where sometimes we progress and sometimes we go backwards, where every so often we change course and go in different directions, and in which we can compare societies of thousands of years ago with modern societies and realize that, in spite of the simple material issues, they may or may not be ahead of us.

I would dare to say that the United States of today, like all the countries of the American continent, just to give an example, is at a lower level than when they declared their independence, because although they possess more material wealth, ideally they have lost so much that many inhabitants of these nations are not even able to understand an idea like that of freedom, which was the main base of all these republics. With the simple fact that Marxism (that is, materialism par excellence) has lashed all of Latin America during the last 20 years, and that today it is reaching the countries of North America, it tells me that the ideal base of these nations has been lost.

Listen to the founding fathers and the liberators of America speak and notice how they compare modern nations with millenary nations, because their vision was not focused only on material issues, but rather, was on the contrary, an ideal vision of history.

It will be up to you to decide, within the framework of the subjectivity that this topic presents, whether the world as a whole has advanced or degenerated in the last millennia, because it depends on the vision, beliefs, and objectives with which you are analyzing the history, because although I believe in a universal, unique and indivisible truth, which indicates the existence of an objective advance or setback, I am not capable of owning it, you are free to judge based on yours opinions.


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In modern society, especially in the West, we

Venezuela is not "in the west"

and never was

, unless one is in Guyana, and asks "where is Venezuela?".

I do feel that humanity reverted back to feudalism, and it is disguised as democracy.
It was usually feudalism, but there is still a reversion.

You got a 29.91% upvote from @luckyvotes courtesy of @stimialiti!

I think you're looking for the fifth leg to the cat, first because Venezuela has nothing to do with the subject of the post, and second because you rely on a word that can be misunderstood after the translation (my fault). When I said "we" I was referring to modern society, not to the West, that is, even China, but it is worth noting that in the West the fiction of infinite progress is more present than in any other place.

It does not matter where in the world they ask "where is Venezuela?", the answer will always be "in the west" because it is geographically located in the western hemisphere. But when we talk about the West in geopolitics, we don't talk about geography, but, depending on the context, of Western civilization or Western culture, which are two different things. Venezuela is not part of Western civilization, but it does shares its culture, because the influencing factors have their same origins in Europe.

On the other hand, and returning to the central topic of the post, I think the degeneration we see now can be even worse than feudalism, because in feudalism everyone could see the King, everyone knew they were his servants, unlike now that the façade of democracy is so strong, that if slavery is imposed, the people will take it as if by their own will.

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So well said and put.

History can never be interpreted in its entirety, because as an individual I always have my subjective view of it. I agree with you in pretty much everything, and I see it the same way you do.

When I wrote my article about my family history, I realized once again that on a level of consideration from above, the individual fates need not be regarded as cruel or unfair. The events are like wave movements and they are indeed not linear. People who penetrate the territories of others bring along not only the positive influences they have, but also the less good ones. This penetration cannot be prevented. You can't influence it, as you say, by regulations, just by a change of attitude.

... But ... those regulations also could be seen as a social approach in order to change attitudes. Things become controversial through law and order ... so discussing them and thinking about the matters can ring in a cultural change.

Sooner or later all nations or kingdoms will pass away and new ones will emerge. Every age seems to have its own holy grail.

... The American independence efforts arose from wanting to cut the bonds with the European kingdoms. The independence was indeed very expensive as native tribes were killed in masses by the invading ones.

On a more individual level, I can agree with the Buddhists who say that people expect their lives to improve steadily. Where this assumption comes from is pointless to ask, but in a nutshell it can be seen as an illusion.

Technology is such a double-edged sword.

On the other hand I do not think that the ancients evaluated man solely according to his spiritual goods and not also according to his material existence. You would have to include the distinction that it was the intellectuals and the philosophers or clergymen who appreciated such ideas. Not the peasants. Which were the majority.

Who actually supplies you with food?
People could only afford their ideas, values and morals because there were servants who took care of their food and drink and their physical well-being. If at least this service would be seen as something high and good. Instead, modern man still looks down on those who sit at the supermarket cash registers, operate the harvesters, load the warehouses and transport the goods by truck. Physical work is devalued and intelligence is given to those who are brain workers.

I am for equality when it comes to physical labour vs. mental labour. One cannot do without the other.

When the ancients talked about the Golden Age, they spoke of an age in which man did not have to do any kind of physical work, because they did not want material goods, food to subsit was given naturally and without the need to work, presumably that fruits and vegetables, in the absence of ignorance and man being totally good, there would be no need to build absolutely nothing.

I suppose that as the population grew, and natural resources were depleted, the objectives were changing, so it was necessary more and more a number of the population to be engaged in work; in ancient Greece it was still not common for the citizens worked, in Athens the work was done by the slaves, and in Sparta the servants did, over the years, in the Europe of the Middle Ages virtually all citizens were servants, although they were legally called "free men" they had to work compulsorily, after the liberal revolutions, the aristocracy was eliminated, so that it reached a point where, in theory, absolutely everyone had to work.

With more and more workers, it is inevitable that more material wealth will be produced, but man does not live for material goods, lives for emotions and feelings, for immaterial things, so he tends to despise physical work, even those who seek material wealth they do it to satisfy their immaterial desires, so that although more and more work becomes more common and more people must work, man still expects a paradise in which to live without having to strive, as in the Garden of Eden.

I would not compare physical and mental labour as equals, because I don't think it is a question of equality as it is of justice, when more than one is needed then that will be carried out more frequently, the ideas are good but you can not eat from them, and physical work is necessary, but you can not innovate by doing just that, it is a fair balance between what society needs and the work necessary to meet those needs.

Wow...powerful post...first how does one define " better" ? Thanks to major leaps in all areas of science...we live a lot longer and have more casual time for the population as a whole...not just the elite class...yet we still have elitists...they just get to have more choices in their daily lives than those of us on tighter financial budgets...

Before modernization people lived to work...most of their days were spent merely surviving and life spans could be very short....today we work to live...yet for many of us there never seems to be enough time...what I have realized is once a new thing turns from a luxury to a necessity...it no longer makes life "better"...it becomes commonplace for everyday life therefore just one more burden...the internet is the perfect example in my lifetime....even break through medicines over time may stamp out a particular virus...only to have a new one surface...technology will never make the human condition perfect...

As long as humans are human...there will be power struggles...inequities...some with more than others...and extending life spans with increasing populations doesnt sound like nivarna to me...

America is unique...we hoped for liberty and justice for all...and as you mentioned...a lack of respect for history makes it too easy to take for granted the rights one has today to mess up life the way we do...and whether you buy into the concept or not...once we began to untie the "one nation under god" concept that knotted us together...we become just like so many other commonplace civilizations where each individual becomes a nation unto themselves...having no common compass to guide us thru the storms...

It is interesting the relationship you make between work and evolution, because that is clearly the reason why there is more material wealth than in the past, but it is also important to differentiate if it is a true evolution because of human ingenuity, or a simple natural reaction to the events of nature. When the ancient Greeks lived, citizens did not usually work, slaves did it, almost everyone had one, then over time, and resources ran out, the number of citizens who had to work was more, and only the elite had rest, the end of slavery and serfdom only meant (in this specific field) that now there would be no elite living from others, so everyone should work, and now thanks to technology, we are trying to have what the Ancient Greeks had more than 2000 years ago, time of freedom without having to work. More than an evolution, it can be the reaction of humans to the challenges posed by nature, such as the scarcity of resources.

Fascinating...although while not a history expert at all...not sure if most Greek citizens didn't have to do some work? Can't imagine they all sat around philosophizing back in the day...as well...it seemed they were always in battle so imagine a lot of citizens were forced into combat roles?

In terms of future...while we may pretend that tech will allow us "not to work"...I think its just the nature of work that will change as I believe you alluded to...more mental and less physical...unless we create a society where genius and tech coupled with incarcerated labor pools produce enough resources for the rest of us to "goof off"?

In most Greek polis the work was done by serfs, while the citizens were engaged in the military and political professions, in Athens the citizens had a lot of leisure time, although they also had a military obligation, and the majority was dedicated to the politics or the professions that most appealed to him, citizens used to have several slaves, even tens of them, not having a slave was synonymous with extreme poverty.

I believe that in the future there will be jobs that don't exist today, but we live under the constant illusion that at some point we can sit down to rest and enjoy the pleasures of life, which I personally don't think will ever happen.

The dynamics and nature of the work, as well as its objectives, will change, although the work will not cease to exist.

Greetings and thanks for sharing your thoughts.

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I will say we take one conscious step forward, and two sub-conscious steps back.

Maybe we are taking steps to the left and the right and not just forward or backward.

To the question in your title, my Magic 8-Ball says:

Yes definitely

Hi! I'm a bot, and this answer was posted automatically. Check this post out for more information.

I really thank you for the philosophical content.
Vote and follow you to read your high quality steenit sometines..

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