This is so interesting. My first husband was an atheist. I am not. For years our conversations about religion and spirituality centred around the "not". What he or I did not believe. One day I challenged him and said that he'd never bothered to ask what I did believe. Why? I never got a satisfactory answer.

After I left the marriage, I devoured books about spirituality on one hand, and on the other, spent a lot of time "ex-husband- and men-bashing" until I realised that it was futile. It wasn't going to change anything and unless I learned from my experience(s), nothing would change. Especially me. When I let go of that, partly with the help of the reading, things shifted. Hugely.

Also, what you say about repeat retreaters or seekers is analagous to what happens in a training environment and when management says its ineffective. It all works in the safety of the training room and where simulations work. In reality, and without the support, it often falls apart. And management won't spend the money (and time) on training that does enable sustained learning. So the wheel turns.