More or Less about Vests

in #steem5 years ago (edited)

This is a very fast post because this came up today in a comment. Don't worry about the numbers, it is the idea that needs to be understood really.

Imagine your vote is worth 10 cents today which is ~5000 SP. That 5000 SP creates these things called Vests and it is they that are actually doing the vote calculations. Vested interest is your stake in the platform, your voice, your vote, etc.

Okay, so 5000 SP is approximately 10,000,000 vests 10MV (crypto people like lots of zeroes)

So, you vote today at 100% (all 10,000,000 vests) and your vote is worth 10 cents.

Overnight , the Gods of Crypto grant Steem a 100x increase in price. That moves your vote in a straight line 100x larger meaning a 10 cent vote is now worth 10 dollars.

However, the Vests remain identical and are still sitting at 10MV.

Now tell me, do your voting habits change when you have a 10 dollar vote? Previously you were voting comments at 20% to make sure they got above the dust threshold but, are you willing to vote them at 2 dollars?

Remember, the Vests are the things doing the voting so when you were voting at 20% and it was worth 2 cents, you were voting with 2MV (2,000,000) vests. Now, you might say that you want to reward more than the 2 cents still but 20 cents for a comment is plenty considering. While a 20 cent vote has a fiat value 10x larger than yesterday, it is actually only using 200,000 vests meaning it is 10x smaller in Steem distribution. Understand?

So, what does this mean?

When price drops it is common that people increase the size of their votes according to the fiat value of something meaning they are using more vests to vote and therefore distributing larger amounts of Steem. When the price increases, they tend to wind back their vote percentage meaning they use less vests and therefore distribute less Steem per vote. In low price ranges they consolidate their votes, at high price points the spread them across more votes.

This is why I say that no matter the price of Steem, it is always a good time to earn it and when prices are low, it is even better. Well, it is better if you are the kind of account that gets supported after the consolidation of voting. Generally this means that you offer something to the community that enough people recognize has value (or you are part of a circle jerk).

I whipped up this chart to demonstrate my SP growth over the last 2 years. It was pretty difficult to workout how to get the numbers back to the dawn of account time - but I am clever like that.


(Thank you @abh12345)

As you can see in the middle there, it is a pretty steady climb which is because I was both consistently producing and getting consistent support. At the start of January 2018 I would often enough have a few 90 -100 dollar posts because Steem price was at the ATH levels of 8 before the steady decline. Very, very steady decline. This meant that my SP growth was steady no matter the price of Steem. Remember why?

Yep, because vests do the voting, not price. And it is likely that I was earning a bit more even because there was less competition in the content pool and more consolidation of vested voting. Get it now?

So, when price goes up significantly, those votes that you are happily taking are likely to reduce in percentage somewhat, especially on the quality of your content. While a picture or shitpost might happily take 2 dollars now, not many people are willing to put 200 dollars on it. And if you have been shitposting all of this time because "it just wasn't worth it", you might have lost some very valuable support for your future or, missed out on gaining some.

Now, while Steem isn't going to go 100x overnight or anytime soon, I used that as an easy example. However, let's say it does do that. What that means is that 1 dollar post today is worth 100 dollars tomorrow. A one dollar post today is a 100% vote with 100MV (100,000,000 vests) or a 50,000 SP account, give or take. Do you think that that same account would be happy voting on your post at 100% if their vote was worth 100 dollars? Unlikely right? if it was worth 50 dollars? 30 dollars? Well, if Steem hits 8 dollars again (I am confident) that 50k SP account will have a vote of 30 dollars. Oh, whether their vote is 1 dollar or 30 dollars, the number of vests doesn't change which means that the amount of Steem distributed is exactly the same.

If you would be happy getting a 30 dollar vote from that account, you should be happy getting a 1 dollar vote from them now. Very happy because most likely, they will adjust their percentage later and vote with less vests which means, you are earning more Steem now - more future value and a higher rate of investment potential. in that scenario, a 1 cent vote is worth a dollar, a 10 cent vote 10 dollars and a 10 dollar vote is equal to 1000 dollars.

Yep, not anytime soon.

What some see as low value now is what I see as their missed opportunity to build something of high value for the future. In my opinion though, no matter the price of Steem, shitposting is unlikely to help you make the cut through the consolidation phases of falling price. Add value to earn value.

You can still have fun, still learn, still play - No matter the price.

I hope this helped some people get a basic understanding of the vests and voting mechanisms.

Taraz
[ a Steem original ]

edit: I will add a link to Asher's post where he can make a chart for you if you ask nicely there in a comment:

https://steemit.com/steem/@abh12345/steem-power-growth-chart-hack

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A $1000 post is nice to dream about. Thanks for sharing more about vests as well. Its always nice to get a little better understanding of Steem every once in a while.

Still snowed under with requests but just popped over hear to read up and learn about what I am presenting :)

Had to read a few paragraphs twice, but I'm with it now. The circle jerks will be easy to spot (not that they aren't already) with a price increase as it is those votes that will likely not be tapered back. 100$ a photo, no problem buddy :D

Thanks for the reference/link/explanations!

lol, I had to add something that made sense of your numbers ;P

It is a bit messy but wanted to keep it a bit more conversational and not split the numbers off although thinking back, might have made it less confusing.

There will be plenty of 100 dollar photos to come, hopefully they are attached to professional photographers instead of professional wankers.

I have experienced the same in both receiving and providing upvotes but what matters for me is the accumulated Steem Power as it is constant across scenarios. The problem is we continue to live and transact in fiat economies which limit our thoughts of potential here. Interestingly, my Steem Power has grown but I have not had a higher Voting Power so I look forward to see my behavior when that starts to creep upward!

Posted using Partiko iOS

Interestingly, my Steem Power has grown but I have not had a higher Voting Power so I look forward to see my behavior when that starts to creep upward!

It will change your behaviour but I would probably think that it will be for the better for you as you will enjoy the curation process even more when being able to make significant changes to the numbers. While you are doing the same thing in steem now, it is hard to visualize through vests - which is my point with this article :)

Dude. $100 Steem I'm dropping $60 upvotes at 100% very rarely, and 60c (1%) upvotes like confetti.
It's important to note, too. Author rewards for individuals may well taper off, (measured in STEEM); but curation rewards won't.
So don't just develop a reputation for quality posts; sit on as much SP as you can manage.
You don't need to stay popular with the heavy hitters if you're one of them.

The confetti is going to fly next time around and it might mean I have to automate some of my voting for the first time ever as I struggle to read 20-30 posts a day so 200 is out of reach. Unless price is high enough I can do it full time ;)

Yep, curation stays the same (granted various considerations) as, your vests are your vests :)

Exquisite post this time @tarazkp .
100$ maybe is a little bit too much but for the example is just right ;-)

If we wake up tomorrow with 30 dollar Steem, this post is going to be legendary. I had to use the 100x to make enough of a differentiation between the numbers for visualization. For me at least, extreme examples help me see clearly.

An excellent breakdown. I remember the first few months I was here seeing it mentioned that when fiat values were lower the payouts were higher. It never made sense to me until recently as I see a low dollar amount on my post that pays out more Steem than higher fiat valued ones last spring/early summer.

Others have definitely increased the vests they vote my posts. It makes sense. I used to rent delegation so I could have more votes, now I am thankful I grew enough from investing and powering up I still have a non dust vote, lol.

They should take some of your posts, create a "Best Of" super post and make all newcomers read them. Your examinations have helped myself and so many others in the year I have been here, even if they didn't always make sense at the time of reading.

Others have definitely increased the vests they vote my posts. It makes sense.

Yes, even many autovoting accounts have adjusted themselves across their voting range. The dust vote is a silly rule but there are some technical implications to it as well as some social ones I think.

even if they didn't always make sense at the time of reading.

Sometimes still, they barely make sense to me at the time of writing but once I put all the little pieces together, it helps me better understand the ecosystem as a whole and if I can transfer what I have learned, it is worth the effort.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!

....perfect explanation, for idiots like me!

I like all votes equally XD

You get a vote for that :D

When I check my profile using #steemworld.org I always see vests but don't know what they mean. But this post has helped me understand a little what vests are all about. Thanks a lot for this post. It is only people who have long term plans for STEEMIT that will keep writing quality posts like me. 😁

Posted using Partiko Android

A lot of people don't understand what the vests mean and only look at the payout figures. if more people understood them, perhaps they would spend more time earning, engaging and vesting into the platform for the future.

I don't think I am going to change my vote percentages when the vote value increases. Maybe adjust slightly but You still have to use your 20 percent everyday and you make the curation. If I am giving you 50 percent now and it is only worth 5 c then why would you change drastically when the price rises. It may look like circle jerking in the end but if I can give out dollars instead of cents I will.

It depends on the voter. In this example, my vote would go from 60 cents to 60 dollars and while I think some things might be worth 60 dollars, with everyone else voting on the same post, very few are worth 600 dollars or, like in the past, 3000 dollars. One of the ighest earning posts on the platform ever was a makeup tutorial that paid out 35,000 dollars.

I understand what you are saying and most likely users will vote less then. If your posts are obtaining $5 now they wont necessarily make $500 under this scenario. I suppose we have a duty if we have a high vote to keep it real and keep the value.

I suppose we have a duty if we have a high vote to keep it real and keep the value.

Yep, this is the thing about it. Enjoy the 'high' value posts now :) There is also the competition issue later, the new and interesting users, the profession app developers etc that will disperse and attract voting more too.

Omg! 35,000 dollars??? If i get that kind of payout with the current exchange rate of my country, i am a millonaire for life. 😂😂😂

This is just similar to a real life scenario. Will you behaviour change if you become a billionaire tomorrow. You might say NO but the reality is that you must change.

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I see what you are saying but votes don't cost you anything. They are free to hand out daily so others can benefit. Maybe I would reduce slightly but I would rather give significant amounts. Interesting thoughts though to see if one will change.

Imagine someone with a 30 dollar vote now (like the applications with delegation), they would have a 3000 dollar vote. it would become senseless and lead to other social issues.

I could see that causing issues and understand what you were saying now. Just haven't thought about how votes could get that big ,but they could.

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