STEEM EXCLUSIVE - Why Are Atheists So Hateful?
@arminnavabi announces his plan to use the Steem blockchain for @atheistrepublic and explains more of the work that he does while encouraging the Steem community to express freely, even if they disagree with him or @atheistrepublic.
Everything that he said in this video has been transcribed and posted to the Steem blockchain as seen below:
INTRODUCTION:
Hi everyone,
So I'm making a Steem exclusive video and I'm going to be making more of these. I really like this platform. I was looking for a place, an environment or a community of people where freedom of expression was valued.
I'm getting more familiar with Steem and all of the different platforms that are using Steem and I like how freedom of expression is valued here. Before this I was looking for a home for @atheistrepublic where censorship is not a thing and out of all the places I was looking, Steem seems to be the most ideal place given that it's not just that people don't believe in censorship, it's that it's impossible to apply censorship.
Even if one of the Steem-based platforms of #steem decides to censor you the content will always be there and nobody can remove it. I'm also here because a lot of the people on Steem value freedom of expression, that's another reason why I like it, and.. as @atheistrepublic, we deal with a lot of censorship because we don't hold back, we don't hold back against ideas that we don't like. And we invite other people to express why they don't like our ideas, no problem.
For this first #SteemExclusive video that I'm putting out there, and I'm going to be making more #steem exclusive videos, especially if I think that it's too spicy for Facebook, YouTube or Twitter, or just that they are not going to allow it, that is some of the content that I am going to put on #steem but there is also some other content that I'm going to be posting just because I feel like this is the best place for it.. a place for @atheistrepublic to post content that we aren't going to put anywhere else just because I think that the Steem community would appreciate it more. Also because I want to support #steem and let other people know that there are other platforms, other than Facebook or YouTube where their ideas are not going to get censored in any way and by making Steem exclusive content I am hoping that I can get some people to check Steem out.
THE MAIN POINT:
The main thing that I wanted to talk about on this first #steem exclusive video is something that is going to come up if it hasn't already come up, but I think it must have already come up and this is response to people who say that "Oh atheists, oh atheism, why do those people have to be so hateful, why do they have to be so anti-other people's views, why can't they let other people believe what they want.. I just want to get that out of the way because it's so frustrating how many times people say that, and even after I put this video out, I am sure some people are going to say it again and I just want to address that.
It is not hateful to disagree with other people's beliefs, and it is not hateful to disagree with other people's opinions, and you don't have to sugarcoat it. You don't have to sugar coat your disagreements, right? and we don't want other people to sugarcoat their disagreements with us.
If you hate a certain idea that doesn't me you hate the people that believe those ideas, you just hate those ideas. The example that I give to people is that you can hate atheism without hating atheists. In the same way we can hate Islam and hate Christianity without hating Muslims, and without hating Christians, okay?
It's not hateful to be completely and fundamentally against certain ideas. And you know, people will be like "You could be respectful to people's beliefs" but that's absolute horeshit.. that's absolute horseshit.
- Ideas don't deserve respect, people deserve respect.
Again, we are consistent here, we are not hypocrites. You don't have to show any respect towards atheism, okay? Respect is meant for people, not ideas. There are no ideas that deserve respect, even good ideas don't deserve respect.
If I have an idea that I think is a good idea and you don't think it's a good idea, go at it, go at it as aggressively as you want. It's not a personal attack on me just because you attack ideas.
Ideas are either right either right or wrong, they are not people, they don't have feelings okay? Go at my ideas as aggressively as you want. In fact, if you are my friend, then I don't think it's a sign of friendship for you to hold back.
I am sure I am wrong about many things and if you hold back against my ideas then how can I evaluate my ideas? I rely on my friends to attack my ideas as much as possible so that I can evaluate them (my ideas) so that I can figure out which ones are right and which ones are wrong, okay.
The examples I give Muslims, because they are some of the most sensitive ones out there, it's true.. btw Hindus are actually extremely sensitive about attacking Hinduism, it's insane. Christians are also sensitive so let's not leave them out but they don't get angry to the point of wanting to kill you or something like that, okay? But they are sensitive as well.
Interestingly enough, the most sensitive ones are Hindus. I used to think it was Muslims but Hindus turn out to be the most sensitive ones when it comes to attacking their religion, but hey.. attack atheism.. I don't care.. I do care but I'm not going to get triggered by it, right?
Here is the example I give to Muslims because I talk to Muslims more than I talk to other religious people. I tell them:
Imagine this Muslim first.. she is very, very against atheism.. she hates, hates atheism and she wants to destroy atheism. She spends all her time attacking atheism okay? and she thinks atheism is cancer but the reason why she hates atheism so much is because she loves atheists and she's worried for them. And she thinks atheists are going to burn in hell and she doesn't want that, she loves them. She hates atheism, not because she hates atheists, she hates atheism because she cares for atheists, and she doesn't want them to suffer eternity in hell. She doesn't want them to be tortured forever".
So when I give this scenario I ask them:
Do you see how someone could be against atheism, and even hate atheism but not atheists at the same time time?
That's an example where they could see how we could separate ideas from people, and if you could see that then we should also be able to see why someone could be able to hate Islam, but not hate Muslims. This is why hating Islam is not hateful to any group of people.
In fact for many of us, it could be the other way around. Many of us hate Islam because of what it does to Muslims. We think the number 1 victims of Islam are Muslims. We think Islam does more harm to Muslims more than any other group of people.
A lot of people hate Islam because of what Islam does to non-Muslims. We're against Islam mostly because of what it does to Muslims. Now as a Muslim, you could say "Well your wrong, Islam is great, Islam doesn't victimize Muslims at all.. Islam is the best thing ever", but even if we disagree on that, even if you say "Wow, Islam is the best thing ever" and I say "Islam is absolutely horrible", even though we disagree on that can you see things from my perspective. I can put myself in your shoes but can you see that even if I am wrong, can you put yourself in my shoes and see that even though I think Islam is horrible and the fact that I hate Islam does not necessarily mean that I hate Muslims, even if I am wrong for hating Islam.
Even if you think that I'm right and that your wrong, that doesn't necessarily mean that I hate Muslims. You could be like "Well I don't care that you don't hate Muslims, you hate Islam and that's bad already" but if you and me want to have a discussion, and if we want to see how we can understand each other and influence each other, it's important for you to understand that even if I'm wrong, that my hate for Islam does not come from a hate for Muslims because that would make our discussion a lot more fruitful.
So it is important for you to understand that my hate for Islam does not come from a hate for Muslims, right? That might make us to be able to get along, even if we disagree with one another. Even if I passionately hate Islam and you passionately hate Atheism or maybe you don't.. I think that we can still be friends, I think that we can get along, even though we hate each others ideas.
I use the word hate because I don't want to hold back and people say "But why do you want to use the word hate?" well I do hate Islam okay? But that's not that big of a deal. Being against a certain idea is just because I disagree with it so fundamentally but agreement of ideas, shouldn't be a condition for friendship. I think we should be able to get along, even if we hate each others ideas.. because those are just ideas and as people, we shouldn't make ideas as a condition for friendship okay?
If we say like "Oh, we agree on this so let's be friends" or "Our disagreements are not that big of a deal". The reason why I want to use the word "Hate" and "Fight" is because I want to say no our disagreements are huge, a big deal, I want to emphasize that are disagreements are a big deal because if you want to de-emphasize how big our disagreements are you are selling the idea that we need some form of agreement for friendship and to me that's dangerous.
I want to sell the idea that we can have passionate, fundamental disagreements and still be friends. And that's why I don't want to say "Yeah, well we agree on this so let's be friends". I want to focus on it the other way around. I want to say that agreements should not be a condition of friendship. I be like:
Look, we actually have very fundamental disagreements and we could still be friends.
We can go and have a debate. I can shit on your ideas, you can shit on my ideas and then we can go and have non-alcoholic drinks with each other right after. How about that? Can we do that? I think we can do that. Do you know why it's important that we do that? Because many of us, we are not going to change each other's opinions and if we wait for each other to change their opinion for us to get along, then the whole world is not going to get along.
- We can still try to convince each other that I'm right and your wrong, and visa versa but more important than that, because that's not going to happen tomorrow, that's not going to happen 10 years from now, that's no going to happen 100 years from now but we can maybe try to learn to live each other, even if we hate each other's opinions. I think we can do that, I think we need to do that and I think we have to do that.
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▶️ 3Speak
Athiests are not hateful, they just don't need someone or fairytales to tell them how to act. They are kind because of higher thinking not because they are scared of a God punishing them in the afterlife.
Tub Cat was once an angry atheist who sought out religious people to debate with in a rather ignorant attempt to convince these people that they did not need to bow down to an imaginary magic man.
After a time, however, Tub Cat realised that people will believe whatever they choose to believe. And that most people will typically believe what they have the strongest emotional connection to. Most people won’t focus on facts and evidence.
Over time, Tub Cat has come to peace with this and rarely debates with religious people. They can believe whatever they want to believe. I am happy and comfortable with my lack of religion and don’t feel compelled to debate and argue any longer.
Tub Cat is certainly happier now without the endless debates and arguments. Most of them were like hitting your head against a Tub Wall anyway.
The point being, Tub Cat no longer carries hatred for other religions. Tub Cat does not care what other people believe. As long as they aren’t harming others and using their religion as an excuse to do so.
@arminnavabi thinks that Islam is significantly harming the Muslim population and that is why he hates that religion.
Yes, there are definitely religious groups out there that are causing harm. I can totally understand feeling hatred towards them.
Anger is exhausting however. And hard to maintain.
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Tub cat is just amazing 😂😂😂
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Hey @arminnavabi I'm in complete agreement with your stance on hating the ideology not the humans born or indoctrinated into it. I've been studying, writing and thinking about Islam since 2001 and consistently the sources I've learned the most from are either apostate Muslims (of any or no faith today) and honest accounts of dhimmitude from those who truly experienced it.
I also think that, contrary to what most people especially in US conservative circles think, open and honest discussion of this is one of the hardest things to have in any of the mainstream public forums and as soon as voices gain any kind of public attention, they're squashed.
Would be delighted to join you on a stream some time to talk these things through, I'm not an atheist, but exactly as you say, we need to tolerate the ideas of others as long as those ideas don't call for our death!
———
And here’s my plug for the #CryptoClassAction where we’re suing Google, Facebook and Twitter for the good of the Cryptocosm. You can read a good explanation here on my blog.
You can join up direct on this form from JPBLiberty.
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I submitted your request for a Live Stream to @arminnavabi and I gave him your contact details (your Twitter account) 👍
P.S. I would love to see you guys have a discussion on #steem and I hope it happens.
I would love to see them have a discussion on steem too💪😍😍
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No idea is above criticism. People in power use censorship to prop up bad ideas and silencing good ideas as evidenced countless times in history.
Steem is basically total free market of ideas, nobody can block anyone posting their thoughts and ideas to the chain. I believe when discourse is totally free, the best ideas win.
I hope you keep posting here and I hope more people realize the potential of this blockchain. Steem on!
I think that most of us here were looking for something different to the established system and it's great to have this alternative. Too much of what we think is being restricted by a few powerful people at the top of the chain and that is not good for anybody. We don't all have to agree and tbh it's not healthy for everybody to think and move in the same way like a flock of sheep. We are all different with different lives and believes and that's ok. As long as people respect those differences we will all be ok.
@arminnavabi is interested in respecting the people behind the differences, not the actual differences (i.e. not respecting ideas that you are extremely against).
Becaming an atheist give us a better way to deal with life (Now I feel I can talk to anybody and have a more rational exchange of ideas). I think religions are weaker a weaker thanks to internet. I really like what you said "It is not hateful to disagree with others people opinions". We need to have different ways to see things if we want to push forward society.
Glad to hear your time on Steem has gone well thus far. Awesome post for your first Steem exclusive. Looking forward to more! Cheers!
Thank you @theycallmedan! 👍
But very often people has their ideas so much concretised and so intensely identify with them, you may step on their foot, a sorry will heal that, but you step on their idea that wound will be permanent.
Religion is an idea taken too seriously, and that is why people can even kill for it.
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@atheistrepublic is trying to prevent, reduce & even eliminate the wounds caused by people criticizing other people's ideas.
Sure..
Debate without insulting others and with an open mind is crucial to heal wounds
I appreciate your effort
"Respect is for people not ideas"
But what if people have lost the fine line between them and their ideas. They are essentially their ideas. When majority of population is living in their heads, they might not demand respect for themselves but their ideas, oh man ! That is far more important to them than who they are. Because who they are is defined by their ideas.
What actually is religion- essentially an idea and you see in the world what is happening, you disrespect an idea and you are gone.
I think the way education is imparted to the children is very important to correct the course of humanity.
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Im an atheist too so ill be very interested to watch your content and see wht you and other have to say.
I have zero religious faith and have in the past been an activist in a number of Atheist movements including the first-ever Pakistani Atheist group but these days attempt not to identify as being an atheist due to what I see to be a more sneering, militant group of people using intellectual superiority as a way to push their own belief system ( and thats what identifying as an atheist is) onto others.
The whole evil of religion and its negative effects on humanity are due to one group forcing belief systems onto others. Any 'force' is always a form of violence in my opinion.
I'm not convinced by you differentiating between respecting people and their belief systems as doing so would suggest you underestimate the power of their faith and the system and the person are thus intrinsically combined.
I look forward to hearing what you have to say and am interested what your aims and end game are.
Best wishes and a very big welcome to you mate :-)
What you are saying might be true about certain atheists but it isn't true about atheism in general.
Having said that, atheists still have beliefs, even if they lack a belief in God.
Hopefully here on the Steem blockchain we can just have good discussions and influence one another in a way that promotes learning and discovery.
I guess that is one of your beliefs but I personally agree with @arminnavabi.
I think it's help to be willing to let go of our beliefs if they are causing others or ourselves to suffer and that can only be done if we respect others and ourself more than our beliefs.
Thank you @nathen007.
@atheistrepublic is a community of atheists so there is more than one of us. @arminnavabi is the founder but there are 6,000 active members.