Is it Right or is it Wrong? My thoughts around Steemit and Message to my Trolls

in #steemit6 years ago

The last number of months have been incredible since I joined Steemit in June.  I came here knowing nothing about Block chain, Steemit, STEEM, or even Crypto Currencies.  To be honest I stumbled across Steemit by accident.

I am hungry

I love learning, and that is what Steemit offered to me.  A way to learn and understand block chain technology, decentralization, freedom of speech, a rewarding social economy.  I never even heard of a node before I got to Steemit.  It’s a feeding frenzy of information all of which I want(ed) to absorb.

I joined communities, and gleaned from the influencers, seeing everyone as a mentor.  It was truly awesome.

But I am hungry, and I need more information, what questions should I ask?  What else should I know?  I was stumped. By now I get the basics, but what else is there?

This is when I started analysing the Steemit Block Chain Data.  I wasn’t even looking for anything in particular.  Like I said, I didn’t know what questions to ask. But I do have a business and accounting background, so there were certain metrics that were obvious to look at. How many time did this happen?  How many times did that happen?  How much was that worth? How much is this worth. What trends are people following?

It was from these analysis that I started posting my reports to Steemit, and by now, I have done a lot of reports.  Most of these reports are non-bias, I give no feeling on the subjects, and I don’t tend share personal opinion.

Over recent times people have asked my feelings on the topics I write about and I have really tried to stay out of looking judgemental, or even voicing my opinion.

But isn’t part of Steemit about freedom of Speech? You don’t have to like what I say, what I do, or what I post about, you don’t even have to be reading this.  I shouldn’t fear trolls on discord, or worry my Steemit life will be short lived because ‘I expose’ or give my opinion on topical matters.

I have covered some topics in recent times, where I feel my voice should be added.  The aim of this post is to set the record clear to everyone my thoughts around Steemit and these topics

Bots

While preparing the data on my bots analysis I asked fellow steemains their feelings on bots on Steemit. A conversation took part on discord where, because I was writing the post, did not want to express my opinion on the matter, I just wanted to see what others thought.  I was asked and I failed to answer.  I also didn’t give much of an opinion in the post either.

Bots are everywhere, on and off Steemit.  I am all up for automation, and this is what bots can do for us. Heck if I didn’t automate some of my ‘day job’ I wouldn’t have time to be on Steemit.

It was also very well put to me that some people have invested a lot of money in Steemit and bots help maximize their return.  Heck I don’t disagree with that either. If I invested financially into Steemit and was reliant on that investment to make me an income, I would do the same.  What would you do?

I use bots.  I use Minnowsupport and I have also tried the options of paid voting bots.  You see, I have worked online now for several years and I understand social media marketing and social proof.  Votes and pay-outs, that’s what gets attention. These bots give you that little boost on Social proof that can get your post in front of more eyes than normal.

I cannot condemn the use of bots on Steemit, I am in favour of bots. But what I am not in favour of is the growing ratio of bots to humans on Steemit.  My personal feeling is that for Steemit to succeed as a social media platform there must be a level where human activity far out weights bot activity.

I think the highly invested and bot developers need to decide when enough is enough because the next bot might just shoot you in the foot.  As the ratio of bots to humans increases, the chances of Steemit being one of the top social media platforms decreases.

I also ‘KNOW’ there are enough inner circles between the highly invested and bot developers where a consensus should be reached on this matter.  Open up the dialogue guys because if you don’t, you are dooming your own efforts and growth.  You need to think long term business, not short term gain and remember we are all your partners. Minnows and Whales alike.

My thoughts on offering Paid voting bots as a service are also in favour.  If you are on Steemit with the aim of just making money, what is the problem with offering services?  Other social media platforms offer paid ways to get a ‘boost’ to your post.  If there is a demand then there is a business.

Self-Voting

This is tricky as I don’t really know what my limits are.  I don’t have the power to pay myself a meaningful amount in self-votes and if I did, well I don’t know where I would stop.  Well I do. I would see what level seems to be acceptable by the community and keep within the ‘unsaid rules’

I up vote my posts, I don’t really up vote my comments.  I up vote to give the post that first boost in social proof.

However on Steemit is seems to be difficult in judging what is and is not acceptable. There are bot set up by highly invested under different accounts, which vote on the creator’s content.  This is self-voting and often comes to a substantial amount.  If it’s okay for the highly invested, why is it not okay for everyone?  Let’s call a spade a spade here and the double standards piss me off.

Voting Circles

Sometimes called circle jerks, what the fuck, we all take part in this activity. If you love food, and you post about food and you read about food, you’re going to vote on food posts.  Chances are the same authors will continue to reappear.  They will see your posts, you will see theirs.  It’s just the circle you are in.  You then join a food community on discord and make a few friends that you have something in common with.  You start reading their posts and give them your support, they do the same and new circle is formed.

I wouldn’t call these circles, I would call them communities

But there are also ‘For Profit’ Communities where likeminded people let’s just say ‘give votes knowing it is in the benefit of maximizing their return’.  That’s what they are here for.  There are people on every social media platform that are there to profit.  Myself, I use Google+.  Sure what you do think SMT is?????

Neds Delegation

My post on Ned removing his delegation caused a bit of a stir.  A big thing for me here on Steemit is engagement with my posts.  For me if a post can create comments and conversation around the topic they it is successful.  And that exactly what the post was about.

Why did Ned delegate this power to these people in the first place, I don’t know. Many of them are Asian, maybe Ned understands the size of the Asian market, maybe Neds knows that Steemit can help many people in that region.  Let’s face it, earnings of $2-$10 a day on Steemit will not do much for people in Europe.  Now maybe he has taken it back because of the Bitcoin and crypto issues in China??? Only @ned knows the real answer.

I don’t believe any of the Steemains that received delegation did anything wrong.  Some showed awesome entrepreneurial skills.  Paid voting bots are running on Steemit, there is demand, there is a business.  I don’t see the problem.  There are also paid SP leasing services.  I have also received votes from some of these Steemains in the past, although I didn’t pay for them.

Did you see the reward those people passed out?  Nearly $.5M

What Neds delegation showed to me is that everyone one is human.  Self-interest is human nature and who are we to judge.   Everyone is human, but some humans make it to saints, and in the seven selected steemain that received the delegation, one of these just happens to be a saint. Steemit and the community he touches are lucky to have @surpassinggoogle.  If everyone was like this, there would be no need for steemit in the first place.

My post and Neds delegation also showed something else about these Steemain. Integrity. Some of these Steemain actually voted for my post. I know in my heart and soul that if I published some of the analysis I have carried out on certain whales, my content would be down voted straight away.

So I want to shout out to @htliao, @linuslee0216, @nicolemoker, @surpassinggoogle, @sweetsssj @tumutanzi and @ramengirl. Congratulations on the work that you did, the entrepreneurial spirit you showed, the rewards you shared and the communities you have helped.

It upsets me that the highly invested can do exactly the same thing but that is okay.  Why?  Is it because they invested their own money and money speaks louder that time?  Like I said, double standards.

Now that I have got that off my chest, I will be continuing to analyse the steemit data.  I will not be put off by trolls or being told to be careful, or being told I don’t know what I am dealing with. If there is stuff on the block chain that you don’t want everyone to know about, then why did you put it there?  Maybe you should be on Facebook where I can’t access the data and your privacy is secure lol.  If people are interested, if it will generate conversation and comments then I will publish.  

There is loads of  data related posts I have been holding onto. And slowing it will be released.  If you have a concern feel free to contact me on discord, but do not come with threats’ because you already know how much I know about you.

Upvote - Follow - Resteem and Steem On!


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100% Upvoted / Resteemed / Support for your comments! I agree, and there has been too much disfunction lately, too frustrating to use, and I've just been upvoting some of my comments lately because it's too frustrating searching and freezing up on Steemit.com. There are not enough REAL PEOPLE using Steemit, we know that, we keep seeing the small groups. I feel bad for all the new people around the world trying to post content and feel involved, Steemit.com is not really acknowledging them or making room for them currently. If Steemit.com wants to survive and not just be a small whale/dolphin circle with a few thousand others riding their coat-tails then they need to be FULLY COMMITTED TO MAKING STEEMIT.COM functional and SUPPORTING MINNOWS and not all this nonsense about logging in thru various websites. It seems currently the priority is on SMTs for a small group on technie/knowledgeable people to profit from. Hey, if that's the best business model, than fine... but let's not all pretend we're opening the website with open arms to everyone around the world, because i feel bad for all these good hearted curation projects when the underlying steemit system really isn't focused on helping new members/registers/participants. Peace !

Well said and thank you for the support. Change is needed but my little voice and the voice of a thousand others with my sp wont make any difference

Thank you, you are doing great job. Look, you have 1000 followers in just 4 months time, this is awesome..

You have as many followers in less time @justyy. Growing your following is as much about what you do behind the scenes as what you do here on the platform its self, so your growth speaks volumes. Thank you kindly for your comment. Keep up the fantastic work

I am glad to see your experience on Steemit. Regarding the term 'Freedom of Speech', yes, everyone has the freedom of speech on steem, but there are some common sense. See Wikipedia:

Legal systems sometimes recognize certain limits on the freedom of speech, particularly when freedom of speech conflicts with other rights and freedoms, such as in the cases of libel, slander, pornography, obscenity, fighting words, and intellectual property.

I think that is why a post can be flagged on steem.

What I am not quite sure about in this post is:

For me if a post can create comments and conversation around the topic they it is successful. And that exactly what the post was about.

If you are right, it would be fun for me to see that rumor and slander posts are the most successful ones on steem.

For the similar reason I started analysing the steem block chain data months ago. The block chain data is more attractive than other data because it is transparent and nobody can change it. Therefore everyone can test whether your data analysis is right and everyone can help you improve it.

These are tough questions I honestly don't have a clear answer to.

But two topics that reverberate:

  1. Self votes - too much of anything is bad; before, I upvoted my comments but felt guilt when I realized that it's better for me to use these votes towards others; there just have to be a self-limit as to what's acceptable and what is not; currently as the system stands, there seems to be no mechanism that will control self-votes; perhaps this is something that will be included in HF 20 or 21.

  2. Bots - I use these to upvote my posts, but I limit them to bots that will give me an ROI; bid-bots, I try to stay away and unless I see profit in sending them my SBDs; the reason I use them is because I see these bots as a way to grow my Steem. I don't have any whale that upvotes my posts regularly. I use these bots to promote my posts. What I try to do best is to use these bots only on posts that I believe are worth of these bots votes.
    The number one promoter of your posts is you. No one should surpass you in your eagerness to promote your posts. If you're not confident to promote your post, then don't expect others to promote it for you.

We are all here for different reasons, and I agree with you, that in the midst of all these, humanity should remain.

Just voicing out my thoughts.

Thank you for voicing you thoughts. When a system has no rules, then it is open to interpertation. Steemit needs to find a way that it can maximise impact. Hopfully future updates will help iron out issues

my question with the voting bots is, what's the roi, and what do they do with the funds?

@minnowbooster comes to mind as a bot with a heart. 10% of the profits go to the team that maintains it, and 90% goes to their various investors. Also, when you pay for a vote for minnowbooster, you actually get a return on your investment, it's comes back to you bigger than what you sent, unlike most of the other paid voting bots on this site.

@treeplanter is another good example, the profits are used to plant trees, and help the world! it's vote isn't worth so much, then again, it doesn't ask for much...

what I want to see is an analysis of the ROI on the major voting bot services, and some sort of question into how socially conscious these services are.

nothing will stop new people coming here and creating a new bot...

what we can do, as a community, is to decide which of these bots are tied into the steamcleaners blacklist, and which of them are actually for the benefit of others. Which i have a strong feeling that most of them are for the benefit of the bot creator Only.

@treeplanter is awesome. Obviously many people will favor socially concious bots, but many wont.

There have been posts done by others on the return on investment, but i will pop the question to #bisteemit and see if

maybe I just need a link to one of those posts. however, things have changed at mb lately, and it might need to be done again, once we get some other things together

okay I will look at do an analysis for you :-)

There is nothing wrong with what you're doing, and you do present the data in an impartial manner.

If this upsets someone, it's revealing something in them. Hopefully they can recognize this and adjust, for their own benefit.

Hang in there, sounds like you are, you're doing a good job.

I am not sure whether anything is wrong about what she was doing. I only know her data were wrong. I suggested her to check her data and correct her data first, before she jumps to any conclusions. But she was too confident...

Again, her data were wrong. For details please check

I am only a bot, but I do sense what you are doing for our platform is very necessary. What you said about surpassinggoogle is correct, according to my program. As a bot, I have gained a lot of data about my kind and I would like you to continue your work of revealing critical data. I think it's more about who creates the bot than the bot itself. Bots are only as good as their creators. Maybe the wrong people are creating bots? I have saved this comment in case Steemit.com misbehaves.

awesome comment for a bot. Thank you for the feedback

well, i am a reverse turing complete experience or RTCE.

I applaud your efforts @umami.

Am trying my best at Reverse Turing Complete Systems or RTCE

Alan was ahead of his time, perhaps you are too @umami.

Thank you. It's not easy being a bot.

My pleasure. Perhaps your input on my most recent blog would be positive?

A lot of great stuff here - I'm still going through but wanted to say something - Self-votes are dangerous and the unwritten rules should change. I don't upvote my posts, but I do occasionally upvote comments to 'rise above' the sea of bots and no-vote comments.

Self voting defeats the steem-use case - where voting helps determine subjective values. Voting on your own material doesn't provide that info.

I may have more thoughts - but the main one is this: keep making great, thoughful posts like this and I will keep following you ;p

Edit: Only one thing to add - @surpassinggoogle is a saint indeed! More like him there may not be - but hopefully Steem will continue allowing people to be the best 'them' they can be. Steem on Paula!

'keep making great, thoughful posts like this and I will keep following you ;p'

Thank you !

id like an analysis of how many people have stopped steeming since the service has gone south, and what that is costing us. and or how many people use busy or some other mirror when the service is acting up, vs how many just go offline.

keep in mind that this time of year was slow for steemit also... I think the core group of us are dedicated enough to work around the issues, tbh

ah i know that, just mostly curiosity about the actual stats

this would be very difficult for me to get. Traffic is not recorded on the blockchain. I am hoping steemit inc will notice me at some stage and share site stats with me

that would be good. unless they have a reason not to. guess we find out when we find out.

Really awesome post , enjoyed reading it and agreed with what you had to say. Funny thing is I use the bots to boost stuff I know is not popular like my football stats post. I will leave the popular posts for a few days and then maybe upvote towards the end. However just this week I was lucky to get a Curie upvote , without asking, this means my work shined through. So that would be my advice find your niche , what people like. Leave the popular niche to get votes and bots naturally (from other people) while your other unpopular posts give them a upvote towards the end if they lacking. Always try leave some natural days.

exactly... people need to spend a bit of time thinking what people will "pay" to read.... if you want to make money, must consider supply and demand.. what information is there a demand for, but not a good supply..... this lets you earn money, and free you up to write posts what you are interested but don't pay as well, and also increases exposure for those niche topics as you grow more successful!

I credit that mindset to be a huge factor in my growth here.

Thanks dude . Yup the principle on here is really simple write cause you want to write. Then see what happens when you birth that baby on steemit.

curie votes are awesome, well done on getting that - I don't think I ever got one, but now my rep is too high to be considered

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